“Allah is only for Muslims, that was my stand” – Harun
(The Kuala Lumpur Post) - Pas Dewan Ulama chief Datuk Harun Taib says Vatican City ambassador to Malaysia Archbishop Joseph Marino has no business to speak on matters which may affect the sensitivity of Muslims.”Saying Marino should be respectful over matters relating to Islam in this country, Harun added:“He should understand that this is a Muslim country. This is a Muslim country, not a European or Christian country. His remarks are uncalled for.” Harun said this to The Mole on Friday when asked to comment on remarks made by Marino in a news report on Thursday where he applauded the stand by the Christian Federation of Malaysia in using “Allah” in the Bible to refer to God.
Also see: Bishop calls for Najib to take stand against Perkasa, Jati
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Umno-backed Malay-rights group Perkasa and Muslim rights group Jati had demanded that the Najib administration kick out the Vatican’s envoy Archbishop Joseph Marino if the latter does not withdraw his support for the local church’s campaign to use the word Allah to describe God. They also demanded that he issue a public apology within seven days.-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Full article: http://www.malaysia-chronicle.com
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And all the bishop said was ...
"In terms of how they presented the arguments in favour, it seems to be quite logical and acceptable,”.
He never implied open support.!
if he wasn't a priest , it will be taken as statement from a rational minded wise person, and also what many in the country think as well , on both sides of the religious divide , except many are afraid to voice it out worried about getting hung out to dry...(he is a catholic priest, for goodness sake , not a foreign diplomat here to promote bilateral trade )
Besides saying the local churches presenting “logical and acceptable” argument he also stated that the ongoing appeal was an “internal matter” when asked to comment further on the dispute. That's inferring
in effect he didn't wish to get involved in a domestic quarrel but just airing his views as a individual in his personal capacity as a learned clergy.
Seems like neutral diplomatic double speak. Yet no one points this out,b4 this madness gets out of hand and the cycle keeps repeating itself on a unending slug fest.Christian bashing n punch back blow for blow.
My say...
Most people believe that everyone has a degree of wisdom, innate or spiritual wisdom, some have a lot of it, some a little, some almost none .but nonetheless everyone also believes that no matter how much we have, we can always use more of it…
In religion it is an absolute , either you are wise or you are foolish, time and again we come across descriptions saying the wise person did this or said that and the foolish person did or remarked so and so.
More simply, either you are wise or you are not..
In the religious sense , using wisdom is an imperative command from God , it is not an option but a requirement..
And judging from the responses to this Allah issue . Is it really beyond solution or definitive depiction ? Is wisdom or foolishness being applied in the response to this highly sensitive issue that can rip apart the fabric of our close- knit society?
Never has there been a more dire need of wisdom to ensure that religious bigotry and racial strife will not be played up to intense xenophohic levels .
Khaled Samad (PAS) Marina Mahathir (Social activist) ,Yusri Mohamad( Malaysian Islamic Youth Movement )
debate on the ownership of the word ALLAH at AL Jazeera
More than 60 per cent of the country’s Christians, believed to number just under 2.8 million, are Malay-speaking Bumiputeras from Sabah and Sarawak.
July 3 — An evangelical church group is now being investigated for posting a Facebook message urging Christians to pray for the blessings of “Allah”, a word still in the center of a tug-of-war battle that has been threatening religious harmony in multiracial Malaysia.
Vatican backs Christian Malaysians’ right to ‘Allah’ as logical -
PETALING JAYA, July 11 — The Vatican expressed support today for the right of Christian Malaysians to use “Allah” to call their god, but said that the ongoing row with Muslims here was a dispute between the local Catholic Church and the government.
Here is a brief view to ponder on why ALLAH is not an exclusive word for malay/muslims to refer to God.
Hence is there only one Rabb or many Rabbs? And if there were only one Rabb then the Christians would share the Rabb of the Muslims. And since we have only one Rabb and we all share the same Rabb and this Rabb is called Allah then the Rabb of the Christians is also called Allah.
How will the court rule regarding the ‘Allah’ word issue? I really don’t know but one thing I do know is that it can never be resolved. And it can never be resolved because we are using man-made laws to try to resolve what many perceive as God’s laws. And the ‘Father Lord’ and ‘Mother Justice’ are in conflict about the meaning of justice.
From: http://www.malaysia-today.net-resolving-an-unresolvable-issue
..................................................................................................................................................................................
My say:
Rabb is also an Arabic word meaning Lord, Sustainer, Cherisher, Master, which in Islamic context refers to Allah.- In the Qur'an Rabb is one of the usual Names of God . Yet the literal meaning of the word is Sustainer and Master, and if in that sense, a man is the "rabb" of his house. Notice also how similar sounding it is to the hebrew RABBI which may have same etymology.
Religious bigots should be ashamed of themselves,
http://dumdumtrivia.blogspot.com/the-sally-yen-insult-of-islam
also read how-the-allah-issue-started/
"In terms of how they presented the arguments in favour, it seems to be quite logical and acceptable,”.
He never implied open support.!
if he wasn't a priest , it will be taken as statement from a rational minded wise person, and also what many in the country think as well , on both sides of the religious divide , except many are afraid to voice it out worried about getting hung out to dry...(he is a catholic priest, for goodness sake , not a foreign diplomat here to promote bilateral trade )
Besides saying the local churches presenting “logical and acceptable” argument he also stated that the ongoing appeal was an “internal matter” when asked to comment further on the dispute. That's inferring
in effect he didn't wish to get involved in a domestic quarrel but just airing his views as a individual in his personal capacity as a learned clergy.
Seems like neutral diplomatic double speak. Yet no one points this out,b4 this madness gets out of hand and the cycle keeps repeating itself on a unending slug fest.Christian bashing n punch back blow for blow.
My say...
Most people believe that everyone has a degree of wisdom, innate or spiritual wisdom, some have a lot of it, some a little, some almost none .but nonetheless everyone also believes that no matter how much we have, we can always use more of it…
In religion it is an absolute , either you are wise or you are foolish, time and again we come across descriptions saying the wise person did this or said that and the foolish person did or remarked so and so.
More simply, either you are wise or you are not..
In the religious sense , using wisdom is an imperative command from God , it is not an option but a requirement..
And judging from the responses to this Allah issue . Is it really beyond solution or definitive depiction ? Is wisdom or foolishness being applied in the response to this highly sensitive issue that can rip apart the fabric of our close- knit society?
Never has there been a more dire need of wisdom to ensure that religious bigotry and racial strife will not be played up to intense xenophohic levels .
Khaled Samad (PAS) Marina Mahathir (Social activist) ,Yusri Mohamad( Malaysian Islamic Youth Movement )
debate on the ownership of the word ALLAH at AL Jazeera
Church group under probe for ‘Allah’ Facebook post
More than 60 per cent of the country’s Christians, believed to number just under 2.8 million, are Malay-speaking Bumiputeras from Sabah and Sarawak.July 3 — An evangelical church group is now being investigated for posting a Facebook message urging Christians to pray for the blessings of “Allah”, a word still in the center of a tug-of-war battle that has been threatening religious harmony in multiracial Malaysia.
Selangor PAS commissioner Dr Abd Rani Osman confirmed with The Malay Mail Online yesterday that the Selangor Islamic Religious Department (JAIS) is investigating the National Evangelical Christian Fellowship of Malaysia (NECF), despite the state government’s earlier attempt at intervention.
- See more at: http://www.themalaymailonline.com/Vatican backs Christian Malaysians’ right to ‘Allah’ as logical -
In his first media interview here, the Vatican’s first envoy to Malaysia, Archbishop Joseph Marino (picture), observed that the “Allah” storm that has been raging here for the past five years was unique to this Southeast Asian nation due to the widespread use of the Malay language, the lingua franca of Malaysia’s Bumiputera Christians.
He indicated that the local churches have presented a “logical and acceptable” argument to counter the allegations by some hardline Muslims here that “Allah”, a word of Middle Eastern origin, was exclusive to Islam.
“But the document that they produce seems to be very well-presented in terms of explaining why Christians use this word,” the apostolic nuncio said, referring to the Christian Federation of Malaysia’s (CFM) fact sheet on the “Allah” released a couple of months ago.
But Marino carefully pointed out that the ongoing appeal by the Home Ministry to reverse a 2009 High Court judgment in favour of the Catholic Church was an “internal matter” when asked to comment further on the dispute.
sourced:: http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malaysia/article/
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------sourced:: http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malaysia/article/
Here is a brief view to ponder on why ALLAH is not an exclusive word for malay/muslims to refer to God.
How will the court rule regarding the ‘Allah’ word issue? I really don’t know but one thing I do know is that it can never be resolved. And it can never be resolved because we are using man-made laws to try to resolve what many perceive as God’s laws. And the ‘Father Lord’ and ‘Mother Justice’ are in conflict about the meaning of justice.
From: http://www.malaysia-today.net-resolving-an-unresolvable-issue
..................................................................................................................................................................................
My say:
Rabb is also an Arabic word meaning Lord, Sustainer, Cherisher, Master, which in Islamic context refers to Allah.- In the Qur'an Rabb is one of the usual Names of God . Yet the literal meaning of the word is Sustainer and Master, and if in that sense, a man is the "rabb" of his house. Notice also how similar sounding it is to the hebrew RABBI which may have same etymology.
Religious bigots should be ashamed of themselves,
http://dumdumtrivia.blogspot.com/the-sally-yen-insult-of-islam
also read how-the-allah-issue-started/
The dispute between Christianity and Islam lies in the doctrine of the Trinity,- Father , Son and Holy Spirit as one Godhead and the resurrection- .that Islam counters never happpened- but only acknowledges Jesus as a prophet . Muslim scholars will vehemently brush the doctrine of christian beliefs and teachings aside , no such thing as the Son of God or Holy spirit . Despite that the Arabic terms for the holy Trinity are Allah al-ab meaning God the Father, Allah al-ibn mean God the Son, and Allah al-ru? al-quds, meaning God the Holy Spirit and their term for Jesus is usually Yasu not the muslim reference” ISA”..
So , for Malaysia to claim exclusivity for the term “ALLAH” to be used only in the Islamic context,dare I say, seems a bit arrogant if not Xeno phobic or Xeno manic..(if there is such a word).
Was at church that had invited a guest pastor who has been servicing the Indonesian Christians for close to a decade , and when he prayed for the congregation, he chosed to pray in Bahasa Indonesia and whenever invoking the Almighty’s name, ALLAH was used, not intentional but second nature to him .
Hence ,with respect, the Malaysian Malays are in default Muslims,but my question will be , is it possible for a race or language to claim exclusive ownership to a word in reference to the Almighty.?
But so far, impression is that there is stubborn resistance to knowledge about the issue among the faithful , adhering religiously to teachings and be easily outraged at a perceived challenge to their faith - selectively .hearing only what they want to hear that can rile up their passions in defence..
Resolution can only come via understanding which no one seems to be eager to promote - anxious in jeopardising own self vested interest or incurring the wrath of many.!